Say No in Plural to the ‘Say No to Burqas’ Mural

An Open Letter to Marrickville Council,

As you are aware, for over six months there has been a large racist mural painted on the wall of a
private building facing the train line on Station St. in Newtown. The mural, which has repeatedly
changed after being defaced, focuses on an anti-burqa slogan. The presence of the mural and the
attitudes it espouses are offensive and unacceptable.

The mural is particularly problematic because of what it represents: the persistence of a xenophobic,
racist and rabidly far right politics in Sydney. The mural dog whistles to these tendencies and seeks to
publicly legitimize attacks on all forms of cultural difference.

To be clear, this mural is not about women’s rights. It is an attempt to transform women’s dress into
cultural battlefield over who is entitled to live in Sydney – those ‘like us’ (i.e. the white, heterosexual,
property owning, middle class norm) over those who are ‘different’, everybody who does not, or will
not participate in reproducing the dominance of those values. This mural seeks to curtail freedom of
religious expression and choice under the guise of free speech.

Allowing the mural to remain directly contradicts the Marrickville Council’s policies on diversity,
multiculturalism and discrimination.

The Marrickville Council 2010 Community Strategic plan states that the entire strategic direction
of council policy should be “based on the social justice principles of equity, access, participation
and rights” 1 The Council’s principle council document addressing multiculturalism, Strengthening
Marrickville’s Migrant Communities states that its purpose is to “support multiculturalism in
Marrickville”. The policy reference’s the “council’s commitment to supporting and enhancing
cultural diversity at its most local level and ensuring that diversity of cultures, including local
Aboriginal communities and those brought to Marrickville through migration and lifestyle choice,
have the opportunity to express their chosen cultural life including cultural practices and languages, as
well as having access to the collective culture of the local area, enjoying and benefiting from a sense
of belonging.” 2

The rejection of cultural difference that the mural advocates is deeply unpopular in Marrickville.
From the extensive consultation undertaken as part of developing the strategic plan “maintaining
cultural diversity” was identified by the community as one of the top eight issues of most importance.3

The inaction of the council regarding the anti-burqa mural and the broader implications that its
presence demonstrates is unacceptable given these conflicts with the Council’s own policies, and
community opinion.

The people of Sydney, the people of Marrickville do not accept the presence of these attitudes in
our communities. We are requesting that the Marrickville council take the opportunity to join us in
rejecting hatred and xenophobia in all its forms.

We have two simple requests:

1: We ask that the Marrickville Council take whatever steps necessary to get this mural
removed.

2: We ask that the Council act quickly to make prominent public space available for local
Muslim women to paint their own mural, and for other local artists to paint mural’s celebrating
difference.

Timeliness in this issue is paramount. Every day that this mural remains, that these attitudes are aired
and legitimized, is a day that those attitudes are given the opportunity to grow and foster support. We
request that the council takes immediate steps so as to ensure these requests are met by June of this
year.

________________________________________

1 Our Place Our Vision, Marrickville Council Community Strategic Plan 2010 pp. 6

http://www.marrickville.nsw.gov.au/marrwr/_assets/main/lib65116/mcsp.pdf
2 Strengthening Marrickville’s Migrant Communities, Marrickville Council, 2011
3 Our Place Our Vision, Marrickville Council Community Strategic Plan 2010 pp. 8

________________________________________

We are calling on all people to create opposition and alternatives to
the “say no to burqas” mural.

The “say no to burqas” mural has been up in Newtown for more than
6 months now. Though there has been plenty of dissent, the mural
remains. Far from ‘protecting oppressed women’, the mural works to
target and isolate Muslim women and incite fear amongst the general
public.

What wider themes of racism does the mural represent?

What would women’s emancipation REALLY look like?

And how can we work together to make emancipation for all, Muslims
and non-Muslims, a reality?

We invite YOU to create artwork inspired by these themes.
Be part of a visual, aural, sensual display of creative dissent!

:: Artworks may be of any discipline.

:: Expressions of interest with details of the work – 22nd April.

:: Artworks must be delivered directly to the Newtown Community
Centre on 5th May.

::NO DISRESPECT will be held on the 6th and 7th May 2011.
::NO DISRESPECT is being hosted by and is a fundraiser for the Cross
Border Collective, MySydney and Justice and Arts Network. If you wish
to sell your work, 20% of the sale price is asked to be donated to Cross
Border Collective’s, MySydney’s and the Justice and Arts Network’s
ongoing projects. Even better, if you would like to donate your work
to fundraise for these not-for-profit groups, it would be greatly
appreciated!
:: If you or your artwork have any special needs, such as access to the
exhibition space, projections, large artwork size (over 1 metre) or weight
(over 10 kilos), please check with the organisers to see what we can
arrange together.
:: Cross Border Collective, MySydney and Justice and Arts Network
retains the right to decline artworks if the content does not fit the above
guidelines.

64 thoughts on “Say No in Plural to the ‘Say No to Burqas’ Mural

  1. Bit of a minefield this one. The idiotic ‘Boycott Israel’ campaign that Fiona Byrne and the Marrickville Council has latched on to arguably is a form of racial intolerance. Sure I think as a nation we should limit if not stop cooperation with Israel’s military – but boycotting Israeli goods and businesses to me is reminiscent of Nazi boycott of Jewish shops. Any attempt by council to remove this mural would be hypocritical unless they drop this disproportionate campaign. (for Mike Carlton’s take- http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/politics/the-sport-the-spin-and-the-spurious-20110401-1creq.html )

    • I can’t agree with you there unless by definition Israel is an exclusively Jewish state (which would make Israel itself racist). Israel does have small Arab, Christian and other communities. Such a boycott affects them too.

      The Greens NSW should’ve campaigned on more local issues, for sure. But remember we once used to make South Africa a pariah state for its racist apartheid policies – was that racist?

  2. In ages gone by, the peoples and cultures of Egypt, Syria, Bactria, Persia, India, Libya and elsewhere in North Africa, Anatolia and the rest of the Byzantine empire, the Balkans, Spain, Southern Italy and elsewhere would LOVE to have been able to simply Say No To Burqas…and all else that entailed and doomed them to.

    You.
    You though.
    You God-damned, confounded, spite filled, hateful traitors are actually WELCOMING the betrayal and invasion of your country, and subjugation of your people!!!

    • “You God-damned, confounded, spite filled, hateful traitors are actually WELCOMING the betrayal and invasion of your country, and subjugation of your people!!!”
      Traitors? Betrayal and invasion? Subjugation?
      First there is no Country anywhere in the world that is being subjugated by migration. So thats bullshit.
      An invasion is where a nations military another nations territory with the intent of causing destruction or taking it over etc. This obviously isn’t happening because the only forogn military prescence in Australia is the US and we have various treaties and agreements that allow them to be in place.
      As for betrayal well actually that would be you as various polls show that the overwhelmingly vast majority of australians welcome immigration and only an insignificant minority pine for the bad old days of white australia. A policy that was abandoned due to public pressure. Because the public thought it was crap.
      And a traitor would be someone giving secret intelligence to a foreign power and simply isn’t applicable.

      I suggest you learn the meaning of words before you use them.

  3. The incredible thing is, that Israel or Palestine, any of these situations around the world..we were far away and above, free from them.
    Immigration and this damned “multiculturalism” that is brought upon us and that you recklessly, heedlessly, and callously support IS bringing all these situations down upon us!
    That’s either complete and total insanity…or else something much worse!

  4. muckbaker…you’re almost close to realising what’s wrong with all this.
    You fail to realise though, that the deliberate and malicious introduction of foreign racial and national groups, and clashing cultures, into White, Western nations IS racism itself.

    Fancying yourself “fighting racism” in your own community (get it, your OWN community?!) and workplace…which translates as fighting against Australians who are justly upset that foreign races and cultures are being brought into our community and workplaces…shows that you’ve still got things wrong.

    The power elites that engineer mass immigration and “multiculturalism”, and the leftist/liberal ideologues like “the antibogan” that assist and encourage this…and who proclaim any Australian who objects to such a “racist”…do absolutely position themselves as judge, jury, and executioner of the Australian people!!!
    As they do in other Western nations.

    You’re waking up to what’s wrong with this, you’ve got to realise how completely wrong it all is.

      • The Nazis were rather keen on the elimination of those whom they saw as mentally unfit. Wonder how Snott would have fared despite his slavish devotion to their ideals?

    • …. yet you keep ignoring polls, statistics pointing to the contrary of what you think the community (hahahahaha get it?) thinks about multiculturalism. You.
      You though.
      You god-damned no gooder traitor to the Australian People who never really bothers to look at different viewpoints other than himself are ACTUALLY opposing multiculturalism even though polls say the opposite and your going to call everyone that does not opposes multiculturalism is a leftie, or a hate filled traitor because they are white yet they are traitors? REALLY?
      I’ve been here for a long time… so as your drivel.

  5. We can safely assume that no SANE woman VOLUNTARILY chooses to shuffle around dressed in a binbag.
    therefore, the burka is either (a) an expression of clinical insanity or
    (b) and expression fo domestic abuse
    Are those aspects of “diversity” which should be celebrated, or are they thing which should be cleaned up?
    And – given that the civilised world is at war in Islamic countries and our young men are dying there, and the Islamic countries have previously sent terrorists to civilised countries – why is “giving terrorists a bag to hide under while escaping justice” something worth celebrating?

    • No, it’s not a safe assumption at all. Perhaps you wouldn’t walk around covered up Mandy, but you cannot speak for other people, nor can you empathise/understand the reasons why a woman would voluntarily wear a hijab, niqab or a burqa.

      How many female Muslims do you know of that have been charged with terrorism here in Australia?

    • Mandy,
      That is not true at all. Your assumption fits in very well with the pop sociology prevalent among many people today, but it is as incorrect as it is disrespectful.

      I have personally been a practicing Muslim for most of my life and come from a place where the burqa, while legally and socially optional, was not exceedingly uncommon. You have not been brought up in an orthodox Muslim household and therefore find it hard to understand the factors involved.

      In many such households, one of the defining guidelines of life is the concept of modesty. Girls, from a young age, are encouraged to be “modest” and shun the urge to deliberately portray a sexualized image of themselves. That is as far as Islam itself goes. Wearing a burqa is not an Islamic requirement.

      The burqa is a purely cultural manifestation of the ideal of modesty. As adults, the vast majority of Muslim women who do wear a burqa do it do it for three reasons:

      a) Because they feel more comfortable not being judged by appearance

      b) As a direct way to implement the ideal of modesty ingrained in childhood; and

      c) As an identity enhancer in a world where being a Muslim is often an invitation to abuse, derision and pure bigotry

      There is zero evidence that women in non-theocratic countries are physically coerced into wearing a burqa. In the Western world, burqa-wearing women have repeatedly stressed that they wear it voluntarily.

      I am an ex-Muslim atheist, so obviously I am not a big fan of Islam. This is not a defense of Islam, but a defense of the right of a woman to freely choose what she wants to wear, regardless of the prevailing norms of society.

      If you think that the countries with military presence in Afghanistan comprise the entire “civilized world”, then you are sadly mistaken. US allies do not constitute the civilized world in it’s entirety.

      Get a grip and get your facts right, before you rush in with some more of the pop sociology that has been made so popular by the right wing. If your beef is with Islam, I am with you all the way. If your beef is with misogyny and genuine domestic abuse, I am with you all the way. If your beef is with certain groups of people, then I am afraid that we must be on opposite sides.

      Cheers.

    • Mandy. The Burka/Jiljab/Veil issue is a very complex one and does not fall into your (a) or (b) category or the view of some on the left that it is an entirely free personal choice for all concerned.
      The veil is often seen as a religious icon, even though it is doctrinally questionable even within Islam. There is also quite a bit of coercion into wearing the veil from family and peers, the extent is however questionable. If there is coercion, then that is where the law has to step in.
      Muslim women should have the right to wear or not wear what they want without coercion. The anti-Burka murals and facebook groups do entirely the opposite of what we all want, which is for women to be able to freely chose what to wear without a social stigma attached. They want to attack a bit of clothing, rather than misogynistic attitudes and in fact these anti-burka mob are misogynistic themselves.
      As for your other points Mandy – it’s time to take off your intellectual burka. The ‘civilised world’ is not in the muslim world to bring civilisation, rather it’s for base geopolitical aims. If terrorists escaping justice under a burka ever did happen, the only people who would be celebrating would be the anti-burka mob.

  6. How is the Burqa issue a RACIST issue? Some don’t like them because they feel it oppresses Muslim women, others see it as a security issue. Nothing to do with race; Frankly is just the easiest way to end an argument (END an argument, not win an argument).

    Why shouldn’t Australians be pissed off at this… These people come here for a better life, refuse to assimilate and embrace our values and them expect us to embrace there culture! I’d respect any culture if I choose to travel/move to a country where that culture is present.

  7. While the burka is not a requirement of Islam it is often seized upon and and used in racist diatribe.
    As for the burka itself so long as the decision to wear it is chosen freely then I don’t really have an issue with it. It’s just a large piece of cloth with the wearer ascribing religious meaning to it. Doesn’t affect anyone else.

  8. Dear Maddy,

    I am currently an ex-pat Australian living in a south-east Asian country. I am of Asian decent. As an Aussie, like you, I have chosen to be where I am now. There are many customs, laws and cultural norms which do not occur here in Australia.

    Before accepting or denying any cultural practice, I first had to evaluate it against what I grew up with and what I believed in. For example, SOME of the population here eat dog meat as a cleansing practice for it is believed to have good healing properties and increases mens’ libido. Do I do this? No. I can say why it is wrong on so many levels, but I do not necessarily force the entire population to think the way I do, NOR do they force me to eat it.

    Another example: when you do business here, you have to make friends and forge a relationship with the person you’re dealing with. It isn’t as simple as say hi, do the transaction, do what you need and leave again. You often sit down with them for coffee/tea/wine and a meal first. Do I do this? Yes. I can say why it is inconvenient on so many levels to focus on the relationship in a transaction rather than the transaction itself. It is a very inefficient way to get things done. Do I find this slightly odd? Hell yeah. But I do it, I go with it. And you know what? I compared this cultural practice against the values I was raised with, found it to be acceptable and went with it. I met one of my best friends in this country exactly like this!

    Just recently, one of my other colleagues decided to rent a new house whilst finishing off their current lease so that they could get the best deal AND get the best location for their money. It also helped them to secure their lease. Culturally here though, you don’t do this AT ALL. This to them is the oddest, weirdest thing you can imagine. Here, you wait till your lease ends AND THEN you start looking. You don’t have two leases at once, because you are seen by the locals as perhaps a bit shady or dishonest. Do you know what though? The locals asked them WHY they did this; some of them didn’t like the answer and hated them. (You can’t win them all). The other locals who were more open-minded understood the logic once it was explained to them properly.

    See, it goes both ways Maddy. It is nowhere near as simple as you make it out to be. Unfortunately, it also shows Maddy that you haven’t lived in another country. Just because you are overseas doesn’t mean you forget who you are and where you came from; be thankful that you live in a country where you don’t have to forget who you are.

    Peace out.

  9. By stating that a group of people are this (and/or that), you are promoting the myth that ALL of that group of people ARE

    The following link is a good example (coming from a “marketing” point of view)

    http://sethgodin.typepad.com/seths_blog/2011/04/the-worst-voice-of-the-brand-is-the-brand.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+typepad%2Fsethsmainblog+%28Seth%27s+Blog%29

    If you ALWAYS cater to the lowest common denominator, you create the NEED for the lowest common denominator

    • Soooo… If I painted a picture of your mum, lying naked on a bed while you suck tenderly at her teat, with the caption ‘Douchebag Dave lives off scum-mum in more ways than one’ on the side of my house, could it be excused as a personal view on my private property too?

      • Personally I wouldn’t care; as a mature adult I don’t offend easily. But the comparison you have made is ridiculous; if you honestly think what you have described (how did you even come up with something like that?) compares with the mural above, you’re not thinking clearly my friend. You need to calm down bro, maybe have a bong or something.

    • except that its a mural in public. so its not the same as if, say he had inside his property on a wall or something. it comes under discrimination.

      • Against whom? He’s not making a statement about a particular race, or even about muslims. The mural is about the burka. How is it discrimination? Perhaps if his mural said “NO TO MUSLIMS” or “NO TO BLACKS” you’d have a point. And how do you deem what is too offensive for the public space? It’s a very fine line.

        I like this website quite a bit, and it gives me a good laugh. I dare say I am more liberal than most people here; the only difference is that I believe people have the right to freedom of speech and expression even if what they have to say makes me uncomfortable. I also don’t believe anyone has a right not to be offended. In a democratic society there are many different viewpoints from all spectrums, some of which certain people may not like. If you don’t like what someone has to say then ignore it; look away from the mural, put down the newspaper, turn off the tv, whatever.

      • Dave, I would suggest that you are being a bit disingenuous here. If the statement started and ended at the burqa, then I would have been inclined to agree with you (although I would still have criticized the painter for going out of his way to offend people). In practice, the burqa is used in public discourse as symbol of Islam and by extension, immigration. Was this painting only about an article of clothing? Really?

        As you can see from the painter’s own comments, the mural seems to be more of an expression of a xenophobic dislike of Islam, rather than opposition to the particular dress itself. This is my view, of course and I do not insist on it. However, even if it the mural’s message was genuinely intended to be restricted to the burqa, it was certainly not interpreted that way. Certainly, he was well aware that such a thing could encourage xenophobic and racist attitudes. If he was not aware, he has now been made aware. His refusal to remove the offensive mural is at best, irresponsible.

        Like you, I support free speech. He can say whatever he wants. However, by the same token, we are also allowed to criticize him for saying what he said. That’s all. I don’t support government intervention here, by the way.

  10. Love this good debate, keep it going and the truth will follow.
    The SAY NO TO BURQAS Mural is only the first step to having this Debate, by having your show you are now part of it.
    Lets keep it safe and peacefull, good luck to you.
    Sergio

    • Hi Sergio,

      A few questions:

      1. Did you honestly believe there was no burqa debate prior to your (ahem) artwork?
      2. Do you believe the burqa should be banned?
      3. If yes, why?
      4. How do you feel about racist fucktards feeling as though racism and /religious cultural discrimination is now acceptable because you’ve painted your shop?
      5. How can you call yourself an artist when your mural is amateur at best?

      • I’ll answer those for him.

        1. Yes, because he’s a narcissistic asshat

        2. Of course

        3. *shrug* No real reason in particular

        4. *shrug* Who gives a shit?

        5. Who said it’s artwork?

      • get over it, the mural was fast and simple to paint and repair, knowing that Islamist and left wing lonies would have a go at it.Can you understand this very simple concept.
        The day you stop hiding behind a pretend name and stand out in the open/will be the day you can ask me these question.
        You are just as bad as people hiding behind a Burqa, your a nobody,no human contact.

        • Unable to answer the questions, Sergio?
          Fucking amateur. Just wanted a headline. Got one, and all the public found out about you was that you were a dropkick lunatic bigot who couldn’t paint his way out of a paper bag.

    • Now let’s analyse some of the many instances where Sergio and his friends are wrong.

      1. It’s a bunch of men telling women what to wear, and like so much Fascist “free speech” it is a form of bullying and intimidation.

      2. The original drawings themselves are amateurish and detract from the streetscape of the area.

      3. Don’t complain to us when your business goes down the tube. Customers don’t like dealing with people they perceive as being Fascists. Especially in a cosmopolitan place like Newtown.

      4. Don’t complain to us that because you have irrevocably decided to associate yourself with hateful bigotry and the dregs of the Australian far right (including someone who has allegedly lied about his war service record) that large institutions may be justifiably somewhat wary of commissioning any of your glasswork from you.

      5. Don’t complain when others exercise their “free speech” and make you an object of contempt, ridicule and pity.

      • Hi Josh
        Let’s clean up your misunderstandings on thses issue.
        1/ the debate is about Australia and what is suitable and what is not. It would have been fantastic if Muslim men used Burqas or Niqabs but they do not, thus it has been made a woman’s issue that it is not. This debate is about the full face covering not the sex under the cloth.
        The KORAN state that Muslims should dress modestly (men and women) it has been clarified by the highest Islamic scholar in Egypt that the Full face covering is not part of Islam. However the Taliban will tell you differently and hopefully you are NOT on their side.
        The burqa and Niqab are a pre-Islamic dress code from some Middle Eastern /Arab areas. These items of clothing were commonly used to cover the property of men (women) while being moved around. Josh you should read up about the slave trade that was very active back then and even in modern times.
        This is not about men or women telling a minority of women what to have over their heads, it is about what the majority of people in Australia feel are appropriate i.e.; security concerns, balance of rules, the reduction of reverse discrimination that is happening against the majority of Australians by selected minorities.
        2/your critique about the standard of art is stupid, the Mural has been kept basic and to the point. It is a debate starter not a master art work, and as you are part of the debate it must be working.
        3/ you have a lot of hate in your heart to make such a comment, nevertheless you can rest easy, and the Mural has done nothing to my Studio. A Socialist that is on welfare cannot afford my work and Islamist does not buy High End Architectural Art Glass or Nudes.
        4/ I stand as an individual making a statement that needs to be talked about, just like we are both talking to each other at this time. I have met and talked to many Australians (left and right of centre). Let me be very clear to you Josh that the only physical damage that has been carried out has been by Socialist and left wing loonies, and very serious death threats have only come from Islamist.
        5/ Josh, the only complaint has come from the Loony Left, if a group of young Muslim Women like the idea of painting positive images of full face coverings, I will be very interested in seeing those images. Good luck to the show, just keep it safe and peaceful.

        • 1. What is suitable in Australia? Is that what the debate is about? How about the suitability of public ‘artworks’ that cause offense and anger and do nothing other than to deepen the divide between marginalised groups and the section of the Australian population who are swayed by fearmongering sensationalist politics and media? Women have been wearing burqas in Australia for decades and there has never been a problem.

          2. The debate only exists because of the opposition and anger you have generated and perpetuated. The burqa debate was started a while back – your ‘artwork’ is anything but insightful or fresh.

          3. If you weren’t a struggling ‘artist’, you would have had no need to create headlines with your arrogant insensitivity.

          4. People make death threats – not exclusively ‘left wings’ and ‘Islamist’. In regards to your ‘mural’, it exists on your private property but is visible to the general public. Therefore any attempt to remove it or deface it is entirely supported by TAB authors.

          5. ‘Loony left’… Your true colours are hideous. If you were only trying to start a debate, you would have had the sense of mind to remain impartial and unbiased, keeping your political persuasions to yourself. But unfortunately you’re identifying yourself as a member of the ‘racist, redneck right’. Your mistake.

  11. “PT go get a job”
    Oh, what a ripper. I don’t need a job, dumbass. I’ve made my money. I’ve done my bit as a volunteer. I’m rich and you’re poor. Now go fuck yourself, you racist clown.

    • Go get a job, says the ‘artist’ who whacks up a child’s painting on a wall with a slogan that will get him all of the publicity he craves.

    • Government handout, how very funny, it so simple to upset you left wing Greens. I am very impressed that you can spell the word RACIST, now all you need to do is understand the true meaning of it.
      Just like your friend TAB, same old borrrring lines.

      • Can’t thank you enough for popping on here and showing your true colours, Sergio. Poor old fuckwit. “I wanted to start a conversation”… Yet you identify yourself as an anti-secularist and a right-wing nut-jockey.

      • Uh…Where exactly did you get the “government handout” part from?

        I can spell a lot better than you. If you’re impressed by that, it’s a pretty sad reflection of your own command over the language. Here’s some real artwork for you.

  12. Hi TAB or what ever you are.
    Mate, i have been making headline before you were born, taking on the Full Face Covering Issue, is a very important issue, but does not control my life. It is just a matter of when the Burqa and Niqabs are band in Australia not if.
    Left wing Islamist like yourself can be as rude and stupid as you like, your the only one that will take any notice of yourself. your such a troll.

    • Hi Sergio,

      Congratulations on your ‘headlines’, and your assumed age advantage. Despite your self-congratulatory manner, you’re still unable to answer some fairly simple questions. What a tosser you are.

      ‘Left wing Islamist like yourself can be as rude and stupid as you like…’

      Nice grammar there, Sergio. We attack the issues here at this blog, and generally the fartarses that turn up to debate can’t hold their own OR spell/use grammar/punctuation. For the record – I’m an Atheist swing voter. And it’s ‘you’re’, not ‘your’.

    • “i have been making headline before you were born”

      Congrats!

      “taking on the Full Face Covering Issue, is a very important issue”

      It’s important only because morons like you have managed to entwine it with rabid Islamophobia and xenophobia.

      “but does not control my life”

      What a relief!

      “It is just a matter of when the Burqa and Niqabs are band in Australia not if.”

      So you say.

      “Left wing Islamist”

      Don’t know anyone here who fits that description.

      “can be as rude and stupid as you like”

      A racist accusing others of being rude and stupid. *applause*

      “your the only one that will take any notice of yourself. your such a troll.”

      And a bit of self-righteous hurt never hurt anyone.

      🙂

    • “your the only one that will take any notice of yourself”
      Actually I found out about this site from a newspaper. They said it spoke out against burning horse shit like yourself Sergio.

  13. In, say, the lower compartment of a train… what is more embarrassing : a woman dressed modestly, or a woman wearing a micro-mini skirt walking up the steps ?

    In 1933, my grand-mother would not set foot out of the house unless she wore a hat and gloves, and my dresses (i was a toddler) had to always well cover my knees. Any shorter was “indecent and sinful”. That was in Western Europe.

    The Burqa makes me uneasy : in OUR society, can we trust it to cover a devout lady, or could a mischievous bag snatcher be hiding under there ?

    As for the Niqab, Hijab, they intrigue me.. Most of the ladies wearing them have remarkably beautiful eyes which are ENHANCED by the veil. Many wear cosmetics, then the head cover attracts attention rather than detracts it.

    Now this is not a criticism, but a genuine question : Since the Creator put hair on the human head, why hide it ?
    Immigration ? Maybe the first question is : Does every person have an inherent right to live wherever they choose on earth ? – Or – should groups who have evolved a way of life be entitled to aim to preserve it, in situ ?

    Perhaps potential newcomers should be well informed about local laws, customs and mores, and immigrate ONLY IF they agree with those, in which case they could integrate happily ?
    Unfortunately, it can’t be retroactive – SORRY .
    I do believe nations can be conquered by immigration, i.e Europe may well be on the way.

    • “The Burqa makes me uneasy : in OUR society, can we trust it to cover a devout lady, or could a mischievous bag snatcher be hiding under there ?”

      Does it really make a difference? If I walk past a big tattooed dude I feel uneasy that he’s going to take my handbag anyway. And I can fully see his face.

      “Does every person have an inherent right to live wherever they choose on earth ?”

      I believe they do. Nobody gets a choice about where they’re born.

    • Nothing new about the movement of people into Europe, that is how the Celts, the Slavs and the Magyars got there. All from somewhere else.

      I doubt if there were peasants waiting for them with “Fuck Off We’re Full” signs.

    • “I do believe nations can be conquered by immigration, i.e Europe may well be on the way.”

      Well, yes! In the 20th century Palestine was conquered by European Jews. And now look at the war-mongering Israeli govt provoking its neighbours, and then retaliating with U.S. financed weaponry.

  14. Buddy, how’s your violent lefty fascists going at the moment?

    I heard a few got arrested at the mural.

    have they been sentenced yet? LOL

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